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Post by sammo on Feb 7, 2012 6:50:13 GMT -9
So, Into the Fray has a few layout issues that I need to address. I’m looking for some input from you guys to get the layout so it will be the most useful for the most people.
For starters, the demand for cutfiles seems to be pretty high, so I have a cutter on the way and will be generating cutfiles for at least the minis. Probably not the cards or counters since they are relatively easy to get cut out the old fashioned way, (well the box counters will get a cutfile, they are a bit trickier). So while I wait for my cutter to arrive, I’ll try and get some feedback about what to do with the layout…
Initially I laid out the cards and minis to match up to make it easier for army building, the color coded card and the minis that went with it printed on the same page. Need another unit of Highpeaks Dervish? Just print that page, get the card and all.
However, I am receiving requests for just the minis (no numeral markers) and for having cutifles. So that puts me in a position of having minis in one PDF, cards in another. That should work out well, since I can get more cards on a page and get more minis per page.
I suppose that my real issue is the number markers for each unit. Here are some options:
1. Just use the minis with white markers, cards have the white markers, those who want to use multiples can use a colored pencil to match up all of the units that belong with a given card.
2. Just minis with no markers, use a separate page of unit “tags” that can be glued to the minis and cards to make them match up with colors.
3. Have minis with no markers and just let people “figure it out,” like most other games seem to do.
4. Option 1 and 3, one set of minis with the white tags for those that want to play ITF, and a set with no tags for those who just want the minis.
Any obvious ideas that I am missing? Any preference from those of you who have purchased already? Any people holding off on purchasing that might be won over by a change in layout?
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Post by aviphysics on Feb 7, 2012 8:19:42 GMT -9
I think option 4 would be best. Could you have a couple tag and card color layers though? I don't think it would be that hard but I have no experience making layered PDFs.
I don't think option 3 is a good idea unless you think your main market is people looking for generic miniatures. If most people don't include markers, then that is just one more way for you to differentiate yourself.
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Post by gilius on Feb 7, 2012 8:38:25 GMT -9
I thought the same as aviphysics: wouldn't a layered PDF solve the issue with the number markers?
ITF is in my list of stuff to buy but since I don't have a cutter, the change doesn't modify my disposition for or against purchasing.
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Post by sammo on Feb 7, 2012 11:26:37 GMT -9
I'd love to do a layered PDF, it would certainly solve quite a few issues with the colored tabs and layouts. However, I don't have access to software that will support layers.
I am using almost entirely freeware (GIMP, InkScape, PrimoPDF and Scribus) for Into the Fray and can't spring the $$$ for a PDF editor that will do layers.
Unless someone has a free/super cheap option for doing layered PDFs that I don't know about I am probably not going to be able to use them. I basically used what resources I have available right now to buy a cutter, so I am more or less broke (at least as far as gaming is concerned) for a little while.
I think that I will re-design the tags so that they are a bit smaller and will fit onto the mini without changing the outline, at least that way there sill not have to be more than one cut file.
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Post by kiladecus on Feb 7, 2012 13:42:14 GMT -9
There is another option...
When I was developing ERA OF WAR, I stumbled upon AVERY labels stickers. They are 1/4" (6cm) round "stickers" that come in a set of 144 (I think) and sell for about $2 USD.
They come in 4 colors per set (Green, Pink, Yellow and Orange) and they can even be removed (if done carefully) and re-applied to a different base (if need be).
I am sorry, I don't have the model number of these, but if you go to the AVERY site, you can see them. I use these on my INTO THE FRAY figures, because I NEVER run more than 4 of any given unit.
This also works because if you have two squads of Boskers, you can use two of hte four colors, and if you have to squads of Hammer of Zor figures, you can use the other two colors to help from having a bunch on one color left.
That is MY suggestion, and it works GREAT for me.
[If you want to see what I am talking about, look at some of my ERA OF WAR pictures, and you will see what I am talking about].
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Post by nikloveland on Feb 7, 2012 14:27:57 GMT -9
Unless someone has a free/super cheap option for doing layered PDFs that I don't know about I am probably not going to be able to use them. I can help you out. I own (and design all our stuff on) an old copy of InDesign. If you layout your pages exactly I can export a layered pdf. I think GIMP can do .psd (Photoshop) files so just have your files in those or even .png is ok too (but it may not be as high quality depending on your compression options).
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Post by sammo on Feb 9, 2012 8:46:26 GMT -9
Awesome Nik!!!
I really appreciate the added help.
So it looks like layered PDFs for the minis with an added cutfile. Good news for Into the Fray. I am getting ready to head out of town for the weekend, but I expect my cutter will be here when I get back and I can work on getting the Layout/Cutfiles ready for everyone.
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Post by sammo on Feb 17, 2012 14:11:01 GMT -9
Just an update,
layout changes are in the works.. the tags have changed a bit so that they don't alter the outline of the mini (so there only needs to be one cut file) and users will soon have the option to print with no tags or one of the colored tags and use a robo cutter on the minis.
A similar layout change is underway with the cards as well.
Once I get the whole layered PDF thing figured out and get cut files made it'll be a snap.
Like many things with ITF the delays occur while I figure out how to make things better, but they tend to be worth it in the long run.
Thanks to Nik for offering to make some layered PDFs for me (I may still take you up on your offer), but I am looking at a couple of options for being able to make layered PDFs myself, which would be a better long term solution.
I'll let everyone know when there is progress.
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Post by gilius on Feb 20, 2012 11:35:33 GMT -9
Hey Sammo
Got the ITF bundle today. I don't have an automated cutter, should I wait for the new layout or go ahead and print the current version? My main concern is if I print some units now and some later (with the new layout) will there be significant differences? I mean, will they look out of place near each other?
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Post by sammo on Feb 20, 2012 13:48:47 GMT -9
Gilius... Thanks for your purchase. As for waiting for the new layout, there is no need to wait for the changes. The only real difference is that that the unit markers (the numbered/colored domed tags at the minis feet) are being replaced with a smaller numbered/colored oval on the back hip of the units. Old unit style... New unit style... I made the change so I wouldn't have to generate 2 different cut files since the tag doesn't change the figures outline. Also, there were some who wanted minis without the tags to use for other games. Other than that the only changes are that the cards are appear 4 to a page in their own PDF, while the minis are in a separate layered PDF for choosing the marker color (or omitting the markers entirely). If you prefer the new style of marker, or want minis whith no marker then you might want to wait for the new layout (if all goes well, available next Monday 2/27), otherwise print away!
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Post by sammo on Feb 27, 2012 21:09:23 GMT -9
Just a quick update.... I'm a little behind my personal deadline ( I was hoping to be done today, but the weekend got away from me a bit ). All of the new PDFs are ready to go, and I've got 4 out of 10 cut-files ready. Another couple of days and these will be ready to go!
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Post by sammo on Mar 1, 2012 23:03:43 GMT -9
The Into the Fray layout changes have just been released!
The changes include moving the miniatures and cards to seperate files, layered miniature PDFs (allowing the minis to be printed without the tags for those who want to use them in other games) and .studio cut-files (for the miniatures only).
If you have already purchased the product you should be able to re-download the new format.
For those of you who have been waiting for the cut-files, now is the time to purchase, especially this weekend with the GMs day sale!!!!
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Post by nikloveland on Mar 2, 2012 5:44:05 GMT -9
Very cool! It will be much easier to assemble now.
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Post by Rhannon on Mar 2, 2012 6:00:01 GMT -9
Perfect, sammo. Thanks.
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