This is a question about female fantasy figures; I'm working on a fantasy figure set of Rogues (thugs, thieves, footpads, skulkers, and fences) and I was thinking about wackyanne's comments about the lack of female figures on the market. There's already barmaids in the tavern patrons set, and the other extreme is Red Sonja (cheesecake with a sword). I'm aiming for somewhere in the middle and trying to create female rogue figures, any ideas or requests for this area? I'm thinking a female pirate, a female assassin, and...that's where I'm drawing a blank. Any ideas here would be appreciated.
Well, it's hard: how much variation could have a Rogue? What i can think are: - acrobats (like, say, a medieval catwoman, but also more like trapezists/gymnast, or that ones that stands on a running horse...) - .... heh.... it's hard. I can only think to a few costumes (pirate, "ninja", black leather, athletic stuffs, even some kind of kimono, perhaps) and some "fast" weapons like some light swords, throwing knifes, whips, poles, ninja stars, blowpipes etc... and then just any combination of the two stuffs
-edit- also some middle-east or indian like costumes can work
Not really wanting to become a feminist champion on the boards, but I'll say this to your "can't think what a female rogue would be other than pirate or assassin":
Anything you can do, I can do better
But seriously, while I do love hyper-feminine tropes as an option, they become tiresome when they dominate the fantasy (story &/or visual) landscape, and the conversation (I'm sure guys feel this too about hyper-masculinity, if not perhaps to the same degree). If you think of these figures as persons before men or women, then the question becomes "What kinds of rogues are there" and then drawing a fairly even mix, or a female and a male version of each variation. Most (men) don't even think that far, because they don't have to (not through malicious intent, but just the inertia of the status quo).
A female rogue in a (realistic??) fantasy setting would be dressed fairly practically, and probably not terribly distinguishable from her male counterpart by the second or third day on the crawl, save in quantity of facial hair. Recently someone posted a collection of photos of athletes, both male and female, which showed the vast variety of the human form. I like the idea of showing more of that off, because it actually downplays the difference between men and women, versus the variety among men and among women... if you catch my drift.
One artist I discovered about the same time I landed here at CW does a great job of illustrating practical yet beautiful clothing for adventurers (fantasy and our world), generally of the female persuasion (though more often goblin than human). Her blog is hchom.com, and two particularly relevant posts would be hchom.com/2011/08/23/fantasy-item-pack/ & hchom.com/2013/09/23/classes/ if you need some inspiration for less hyper-feminine proportions and clothing. (My son Gabriel and I were drooling over her Goblin Market stock just the other day, perhaps I should invite her over to contribute to this month's hoard...)
I don't even know if I'm making sense, or addressing your actual question. Long, hard, tiring day, with another one coming up tomorrow.
TL/DR: A woman in a fantasy setting could and would do much the same, and dress much the same, as a male would, so could be thugs, thieves, footpads, skulkers, and fencers. Generally smaller feet, wider hips, narrower waist, suggestion of breasts, little to no facial hair, more delicate jaw and forehead, perhaps fuller lips/longer hair/darker-longer eyelashes/finer eyebrows....
Wackyanne, i think i agree with you (i "think" just 'cause i'm missing some meaning and i have no time right now to ponder about this).
What i think is the problem, here, is to have some visual difference between all the "sub-type" of rogues, while in reality they will be mostly dressed all the same, depending on the area climate. This is true also for the gender of the subject. So, "hyper-feminine" traits could be a way to differentiate a minis from another, just like a hypertrophic half-naked male becomes a "barbarian" on the side of a less bulge character which is ca be a "fighter".
I don't have anything to add really because Wackyanne said most of it. Any figure you make male, could just as easily be female. I wouldn't worry too much about how effective costumes are vs style/sex appeal and that whole argument. You won't please everyone and for every woman that is offended by scantily clad fantasy females there is another woman that likes her red sonjas. I'm about to release my necromancer leader for my SOBH warband and she isnt wearing much. What I WOULD shy away from is any more "women in refrigerators". we want strong capable representations in the fantasy genre. not more damsels in distress waiting to be rescued.
edit* Also.. i have no problem with "women of the evening" figures. they are as much a part of our history as our present and can easily be represented as just as capable and strong. There was a warhammer fantasy witch elf figure that had a crooked finger and come hither look while hiding a dagger behind her back with the other hand.. i always really loved that miniature.
Last Edit: Dec 5, 2013 14:08:59 GMT -9 by ghostgirl
Post by Vermin King on Dec 5, 2013 18:10:04 GMT -9
good edit there. historically, there have been several notorious females that basically used the 'woman of the evening' guise to cover more dark and dangerous occupations. a stranger from out of town makes a good mark for someone with the motivation to take advantage.
There are no strangers in this world,only people I haven't embarrassed ... yet!
Valeria Queen of Thieves. Just wanted to write tat down so I don't forget it.
WackyAnne - true, anything a male character can do, a female character can do. I'm trying to avoid stereotypes and find something more like archetypes, if that makes any sense. Male and female thieves and rogues will approach a situation diferently, and I'm trying to find that difference in their clothing choices and their body positioning. I'm trying to challenge myself with my drawing as I haven't done a lot of figure drawing in the past.
Thanks for all the ideas, lots of food for thought to throw into the blender in my brain, I'll see what shakes out of my pencil.
Vermin King: Not the style you are looking for, but try a search for 'paper theatre' or 'paper theater', and you will find a few pages of epinal figures. Not many, but I know there are a few
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