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Post by aaron on Aug 3, 2014 12:33:08 GMT -9
I'm not going to lie about this ... I hate making it. I love buying it already made from people who have amazing talent like Fat Dragon, Lord Zsezse Works, Kev's Lounge, Mystic Mountain Productions, Dave Graffam Models and yes even World works before they went teets up. (I never talked to any of them nor have I ever been on their forums so I don't know anything about the bad blood ) anyway the list of skilled terrain makers goes ON and ON so I buy it instead of make it from scratch I mean really why build a car for 5k when I can buy it already made for 3k .... *sigh* all that aside Temporum Oblitus is going to have some terrain elements that I will be selling with the game. Honestly I tried to avoid it I really did. but I have some specific needs that just weren't being met by you other developers , shame on you for not making what I need so I can steel it and sell it as my own! I have come to the conclusion that I don't really like strait lines. this is great when making troops or flats. this is ok when your making some vehicles .... this is a disaster when your making terrain. everything is curved and tapered .... so I have some questions from the masters. how do I do it without wanting to commit suicide using my card stock with one paper cut at a time LOL are their any tutorials on advanced terrain making that I am to lazy to look up myself or I missed when I was being to lazy to notice when I was looking it up? ALSO!! I almost forgot! I only plan on making the terrain I ABSOLUTELY need! nothing more, this means that I will be using all the stuff I got from you guys and I will probably be using it in vidoes and marketing stuff. Never fear!! There will be a Large disclaimer letting people who made the terrain I am using, and a link sending people back to where I got it from! If you don't want to be apart of that please let me know before hand or afterwards or at any time really and I will stop using yours ... if everyone pulls out then I will be forced to make my own and I will cry like a baby!!
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Post by hackbarth on Aug 4, 2014 4:26:34 GMT -9
I have come to the conclusion that I don't really like strait lines. this is great when making troops or flats. this is ok when your making some vehicles .... this is a disaster when your making terrain. everything is curved and tapered .... so I have some questions from the masters. how do I do it without wanting to commit suicide using my card stock with one paper cut at a time LOL are their any tutorials on advanced terrain making that I am to lazy to look up myself or I missed when I was being to lazy to notice when I was looking it up? By making terrain I can assume you are talking about designing terrain, as opposed to assembling terrain? Truly, it seems that we haven't covered terrain designing enough, people here prefer to focus on the character miniatures, they are indeed more fun. But on what exactly you have trouble doing? Any example of what you have been attempting that you though "there must be an easier way to do this" or "how the hell they DO this!?" to share with us?
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Post by aaron on Aug 4, 2014 5:13:48 GMT -9
thanks Hackbarth ! your right I didn't explain myself very well. cones, tubes and curved tubes. and worst yet curved cones. I just keep missing the mark on those and then how the hell do you get that 45 degree angle??? it's maddining!
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Post by hackbarth on Aug 4, 2014 5:25:10 GMT -9
Ouch, that means you need to go back to your geometry textbooks. There's some software that helps (pepakura or google skechtup, maybe?), but for me tackling the math is easier than trying to make the software work.
But make a doodle of what you want and we can try to work the measurements to it.
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Post by aaron on Aug 4, 2014 5:38:03 GMT -9
ya that's what I was afraid of ... me and geometry aren't exactly the closest of friends but I suppose it's time to get better acquainted. It's not that I hate math or anything it's just that I hate math .... kind of , a lot . oh well *sigh* geometry 102 here we come! Maybe I can make some templates when I get them done for other people like me who don't like doing math LOL
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Post by mproteau (Paper Realms) on Aug 4, 2014 6:49:30 GMT -9
If it's a matter of getting geometries down, you might consider using Google SketchUp, to design the model (try to keep it simple!) then use some plugins to flatten it out and/or import it into PePaKuRa and work from there. It's better than nothing, if you're not sure where to start.
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Post by aaron on Aug 4, 2014 8:04:37 GMT -9
Thanks mproteau (Paper Realms), I have Photoshop and I know that somewhere in here I have some powerful measuring tools for creating Geometric shapes but I have never really used them before now sooooo it's probably going to be a learning curve kind of thing. I thanks to Kevin I know about the ruler tool though I have found it's perfectly useless because it only gives you X,Y coordinance and I have no idea how to translate that into mm, cm. inches that sort of thing.... ok so how I do it now .... I use the lines on a model to measure what the other lines should be. when your making boxes this is ok and works just fine but when your making curved lines this falls apart because (as far as I know) their is no way to measure the curve line in Photoshop .... and the line that will be connecting to it has to be longer than the curved line, but how much longer?? and their is no tool or process in Photoshop for measuring circles ... what I have been doing up to now is making a circle , then make a rectangle to go around it and I eyeball it .... print it up and go nope ... change it and repeat the process until it's close enough. I look at other peoples models with tires that have inverted rims and buildings with curved lines that look awesome but when I try that kind of stuff I just get lost and it looks great but fist together terrible.... and I don't really like it LOL soooo I wonder how do they do it? .... not in Photoshop I think LOL
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Post by mproteau (Paper Realms) on Aug 4, 2014 8:21:52 GMT -9
I did a little 3d WWG prop that had some curves to it. I cut a strip of paper to the right width, but way longer than needed, then I taped it to my model and marked where it needed to be. That worked pretty well. For something that was really circular, knowing the circumference of a circle is pi * diameter will serve you well. I did another WWG prop where I used a lot of rectangular faces rather than a curve to make a rounded dormer for a roof. Even with the straight lines, I often didn't properly compensate for the accumulating width of the cardstock over the bends, so it took some trial and error. Hang in there!
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Post by cowboyleland on Aug 4, 2014 20:25:12 GMT -9
I don't know photoshop, but the gimp measuring tool you have to set you units (pixels, inches, mm) in a window at the bottom of the screen, then click and drag the measuring tool to get a length.
Drawing the pattern for a tube with a 45 degree angle at one end is a really cool trick that I learned in drafting class about 30 years ago. I think I remember:
at the top left of your page, draw a circle the circumference of your tube and divide it into 8 or 12 equal parts
Below this (and lined up to it) draw a side view of the "assembled" tube.
Project lines down from the eight points on the first drawing and mark where they intersect the second drawing
Then draw a horizontal line the length of the circumference (pi times D) lined up with the bottom of the side view,
you divide this line up into 8 or 12 equal parts with perpendicular lines.
then you project lines across from the points on the side view and mark where they cross your verticals.
Attach all your points with a gently curving line. Boom, yer done! Cut it out and roll it up. If it works, I remembered right.
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Post by bravesirkevin on Aug 4, 2014 20:50:46 GMT -9
I thanks to Kevin I know about the ruler tool though I have found it's perfectly useless because it only gives you X,Y coordinance and I have no idea how to translate that into mm, cm. inches that sort of thing.... You set your measurement units in Edit>Preferences>Units and Rulers (cntl+K). I think it defaults to pixels, but you can set it to metric or imperial units. Whatever you set here will affect all your measurements with the ruler tool as well as your page rulers and the image size and canvas size defaults, but will not affect your brush sizes as those are always measured in pixels. There are two good ways to do it. The hard way is to go back to your high school geometry textbooks and bone up on all those theorems and then put all those formulae to good use with a compass, protractor and setsquare. The easy way is to build your 3d model in some sort of CAD program and then use appropriate software to unfold it.
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Post by aaron on Aug 5, 2014 5:16:53 GMT -9
cowboyleland that is strange magic you speak of. like cooking indoors in a magic box with numbers. I shall try this method though I will have to re-read your post a few times LOL As Always bravesirkevin you step in a make my life better ! you should teach Photoshop tutorials ... maybe with Lynda.com you could do a whole coarse on making papercraft in Photoshop.
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Post by bravesirkevin on Aug 5, 2014 6:00:39 GMT -9
Given some more thought to your challenge and I think I have a good solution. Instead of using circles use polygons with lots of sides. This tool. What it will do is create a regular vector polygon with as many equal length sides as you dictate. You set the amount of sides over here in the tool dialogue. 24 will give you something very close to circular, which is good for something pretty big. For something small like a 44-gallon drum scaled to 30mm figures, you'd want to go down to 12 or even 6. This is your result. It's a shape made up of pixels, bounded by a very accurate vector mask. Because of the nature of pixels, it's always going to just be an approximation, but the higher your resolution, the more precise the approximation will be. The vector mask on the other hand is completely accurate, with each line segment between 2 points being identical in length. Use the arrow tool to select the vector outline so you can see the points. What you're interested in is the measurement between two points. X. Your cylinder section will consist of 24 rectangles that are X wide. You can use the ruler and measure the gap between the 2 points... ... and then set up a rectangle that is that wide and as tall as you need it to be, and then set 24 duplicates of it in a row. If you know your way around the vector tools, you can actually just grab the line segment and make a rectangle out of it, but that's a bit of an advanced technique so I won't go into it.
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Post by aaron on Aug 5, 2014 7:15:57 GMT -9
I am trying this now! once again Keven you prove your the man!
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Post by okumarts on Aug 5, 2014 8:10:34 GMT -9
Kevin is a terrain god! I have visual proof!
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Post by mproteau (Paper Realms) on Aug 5, 2014 8:19:18 GMT -9
I am R'ing O T F right now, L'ing! Brilliant!
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Post by bravesirkevin on Aug 5, 2014 9:26:34 GMT -9
Kevin is a terrain god! I have visual proof! Haha! That's brilliant! Fun fact: That book was first published in the same year I was born.
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Post by hackbarth on Aug 5, 2014 9:51:28 GMT -9
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Post by aaron on Aug 5, 2014 11:18:34 GMT -9
thanks hackbarth that actually is very helpful.
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