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Post by onepageanon on Jun 18, 2020 5:45:22 GMT -9
Hi everyone, We just released a new starter set for Grimdark Future: Battle for Magellan-2This set contains the core rules, 12 unit stat cards, two full armies with 43 models, 11 terrain pieces and 106 play tokens, all for just $4.99!
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Post by jeffgeorge on Jun 24, 2020 17:12:26 GMT -9
Hey, I LOVE the idea of a simpler, faster-moving rule set as an alternative to 40K, and I'm super stoked by the sample art I've seen of your printable miniatures. But my question for you is, do your mini sets come with an option for black borders, and do they have "real" back-side art? It's impossible to tell from your Patreon page or your listings at Wargame Vault. The only clue I have without putting down money is the B&W line versions available as free samples on your Patreon, and those have mirrored backs.
If your minis have actual backs, I can see using them not JUST for your one-page miniature battles, but also in a wide variety of SF RPG and tabletop miniatures games. Lately, there's been an absolute explosion in really good print-and-play SF skirmish rules sets--Star Breach, Zone Raiders, Rogue Planet, Planet 28, off the top of my head--which would really benefit from high-quality printable armies. But for me and a lot of other paper miniature enthusiasts, mirrored backs are pretty much a deal-breaker.
Please tell me you've got real back art on your minis, so I can start shoveling money at you, okay?
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Post by Toman on Jun 24, 2020 17:18:56 GMT -9
no back art which is a real shame as they are some great figure. I have been pushing for back art since they released them. I don't believe they have black borders either, all of the builds of them I've seen have been white bordered.
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Post by jeffgeorge on Jun 25, 2020 18:24:41 GMT -9
no back art which is a real shame as they are some great figure. I have been pushing for back art since they released them. I don't believe they have black borders either, all of the builds of them I've seen have been white bordered. Darn. That makes me sad. I'm really hankering to put together cardstock armies to play SF skirmish games, but I just can't do no-back minis. Let's hope OPR reads this and gives the idea some thought.
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Post by alloydog on Jun 25, 2020 20:08:34 GMT -9
I'm really hankering to put together cardstock armies to play SF skirmish games, but I just can't do no-back minis. Let's hope OPR reads this and gives the idea some thought. Monsieur Okum's Retro Space, perhaps?
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Post by jeffgeorge on Jun 25, 2020 23:14:13 GMT -9
I'm really hankering to put together cardstock armies to play SF skirmish games, but I just can't do no-back minis. Let's hope OPR reads this and gives the idea some thought. Monsieur Okum's Retro Space, perhaps? Oh, yes, I'm an Okumarts Patreon...got all those. They're great for space opera-type SF RPGs, but I'm looking for squads of power-armored space marines. Maybe David's super-agents set from Save the Day...
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Post by alloydog on Jun 26, 2020 1:29:09 GMT -9
I'm looking for squads of power-armored space marines. Maybe David's super-agents set from Save the Day... Or kit bash some...
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Post by Toman on Jun 26, 2020 11:18:38 GMT -9
Darn. That makes me sad. I'm really hankering to put together cardstock armies to play SF skirmish games, but I just can't do no-back minis. Let's hope OPR reads this and gives the idea some thought. he's said that it will take more time and increase cost, the main goal it seems is to get as many sets out first to see how popular and possibly add backs if they do well. or possibly do less sets but with backs. the OPR community doesn't value backs as much as we do so I doubt we will get backs anytime soon.
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Post by jeffgeorge on Jun 26, 2020 11:56:41 GMT -9
Darn. That makes me sad. I'm really hankering to put together cardstock armies to play SF skirmish games, but I just can't do no-back minis. Let's hope OPR reads this and gives the idea some thought. he's said that it will take more time and increase cost, the main goal it seems is to get as many sets out first to see how popular and possibly add backs if they do well. or possibly do less sets but with backs. the OPR community doesn't value backs as much as we do so I doubt we will get backs anytime soon. Thanks for following up, Toman. I totally get that answer--adding back art and black borders certainly would add to production time and costs. I realize that there are a lot of miniature wargamers out there who are accustomed to playing with double-fronted minis assembled on white-backgrounded rectangles, and not trimmed closely the way that we tend to do here. However, there's a reason that I don't buy those miniature sets--they just look like boardgame standees to me, and not like legit miniatures, and they don't scratch my mini itch. I have to believe that adding backs to the very nice front-side art on their minis, they'd be expanding their audience significantly, and that it would be worth the effort. In fact, I bet there are artists around here that would be willing and able to create backs to match their existing line for very reasonable rates, so that their main artists could continue to focus on new sets. Heck, I'd be willing to do that myself for not much more than nothing. As for just doing backs for my own use, I've done that a few times when I've happened across a front-only mini that I really, really loved and had a specific use for. But in this case, one would need to do backs for at least a couple dozen minis--enough to make up at least two factions--which would be a very large project. If I'm going to invest that much time and energy into a project, I want it to be something that I can somehow monetize, or at the very least, share with the CWF community for free. Twenty to forty hours of work to print one set for my personal use seems...excessive. In any case, I feel like I'm likely to buy that starter set, Magellan-2, for $5, to get the rules and to check out the minis. If I like the ruleset, and I expect to, I'll do a quick back for a space marine and an ork, to get a sense for how long it would take to do the whole set. If that happens, I'll report back here.
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Post by Toman on Jun 26, 2020 19:23:24 GMT -9
the core rules are free on their website if that is what you are interested in trying out. onepagerules.com/
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Post by eledrath on Jun 26, 2020 20:24:34 GMT -9
I love the art on these! Made me smile bright when I saw them! Thanks!
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Post by onepageanon on Aug 29, 2020 6:59:56 GMT -9
Toman jeffgeorge - Sorry for the late reply, but it seems that I didn't have notifications enabled. Anyway, as was mentioned before, doing backs doesn't seem very cost effective right now, however doing black borders is totally doable. Do you mean something like this?
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Post by okumarts on Aug 29, 2020 19:34:21 GMT -9
Oh, yes, I'm an Okumarts Patreon...got all those. They're great for space opera-type SF RPGs, but I'm looking for squads of power-armored space marines. Maybe David's super-agents set from Save the Day... The Super Agents could work. You can get some good variety in there as well to make various forces. I have some Soviet Armoured Troops in Vile Villains 4.
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Post by Toman on Aug 30, 2020 6:24:26 GMT -9
Toman jeffgeorge - Sorry for the late reply, but it seems that I didn't have notifications enabled. Anyway, as was mentioned before, doing backs doesn't seem very cost effective right now, however doing black borders is totally doable. Do you mean something like this? Yea borders like that are good. I eagerly await when you do decide to do backs.
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Post by jeffgeorge on Aug 30, 2020 16:03:01 GMT -9
the core rules are free on their website if that is what you are interested in trying out. onepagerules.com/I did buy the Magellan-2 starter set, and I do like it overall. The style of the artwork is really appealing, and appropriate to the genre and the spirit of the rules. Then life happened and I forgot this project until tonight.
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Post by jeffgeorge on Aug 30, 2020 16:29:54 GMT -9
Toman jeffgeorge - Sorry for the late reply, but it seems that I didn't have notifications enabled. Anyway, as was mentioned before, doing backs doesn't seem very cost effective right now, however doing black borders is totally doable. Do you mean something like this? Yeah, that's the ticket. Folks around here generally like to trim close, and leave only a black border around their minis. You might go a tiny bit wider--that looks like a 1.5 or 2mm border, but bumping it up to 3mm would make it so that users who don't want to trim *quite* that close won't have to. I get that the priorities of users here may not be quite the same as more traditional wargame players, who've been looking at mirror-backed standees for decades. I think the difference may be that the we see our paper miniatures as a final destination and desired endpoint--that is, we see them as legit miniatures, which we'll use on a table with 2.5 and 3D terrain. I suspect that wargamers who are used to rectangular paper borders see those miniatures either as placeholders for fully-painted 3D plastic or metal minis, or as more elaborate versions of the flat cardboard counters that were common in board wargames a generation ago. Admittedly, this is theory on my part, based on nothing but my sense of where people who are not me are coming from, so take it with a grain of salt. As for the importance of black borders, here's a picture I shared years ago, comparing a black-bordered mini with a white-bordered one, both closely trimmed. (These are early minis are from printableheroes , by the way.)
As you can see, the black borders recede into the background, while the white borders are impossible not to see.
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Post by onepageanon on Aug 31, 2020 4:35:02 GMT -9
Toman jeffgeorge Thank you for your feedback, I'm going to re-work all of our existing and future releases to provide a version of the models with thick black borders (and I'll make them a bit thicker as suggested). I'll make sure to update both the files and the pictures shown on WGV/DTRPG as well, giving people that already purchased the old version the new version as well. This might take a good 1-2 months though because we have other priorities right now, but rest assured that it will happen.
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