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Post by squirmydad on Sept 9, 2013 9:55:19 GMT -9
Papercuts 2013 is finished and I think it went rather well. Last year there was a bit of disgruntled fallout at the end of the Showcase and a thread was set up to discuss future options....which had very little discussion...
This is my first year as CiC of the Cardboard Warriors Empire and I implemented the changes that I felt were in the best interests of the continuance of the Showcases. This thread is for the membership to talk about what they liked, what would needs improving, what just plain did not work.
-One shoutbox comment indicated that I should have allowed the option of a third choice for Best in Show; good idea. There were 18 total entries and limiting votes to only two entries was a poor choice on my part.
-This year I got rid of the "Celebrity Judge" concept and made all voting done by members only. In the past I was a celebrity judge but quite honestly I don't feel I'm qualified to critique in a meaningful fashion the work of certain members entries, particularly this year.
-I expanded the categories for entries from 3 to 5 (including Best in Show). Was this too many? Too few?
-I realize I need to advertise sooner and broader for this Showcase. How soon is too soon?* Where else should I be posting notices for this event?
-Should there be prizes for third place?
-Were the prize monies too large? Too small?
Bottom line is that if there is no discussion of these points I'll just do what I feel is best for the Forum and the Showcases. I welcome your feedback and will keep your suggestions in mind for the next Papercuts Showcase.
Thank you, -Eric
* BTW, next year's Showcase is only 11 months away, August 2014.
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Post by spaceranger42 on Sept 9, 2013 10:56:15 GMT -9
I thnk that the prize amounts were quite generous, though they could be scaled back a little. That is part of the glory of this hobby, we don't have to pay tons of cash to stay invovled. 15$ for first and 10$ for second along with the various prize donations would have made the rewards just as sweet as they were. Not that I am complaining or anything.
At first I thought about recommending a separate catagory for published artists/designers but I realized that knowing I would be in competition with "the pros" really made me bring my A Game. I look forward to more critique when I make my model available later tonight.
I would not add it to the Papercuts but one thing I really like from Mini Wargaming.com is that they used to have a monthly challenge in their forums. The mods would pick materials and the submissions would all include those materials. Might be fun to have a challenge forum here too. Not sure of the best way to implement that but I wager the results would always be interesting.
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Post by squirmydad on Sept 9, 2013 11:35:18 GMT -9
I thnk that the prize amounts were quite generous, though they could be scaled back a little. That is part of the glory of this hobby, we don't have to pay tons of cash to stay invovled. 15$ for first and 10$ for second along with the various prize donations would have made the rewards just as sweet as they were. Not that I am complaining or anything. - I didn't actually know how much prize money was going to be available, but there turned out to be some very generous donors. I suppose I can add a 3rd place prize for next year. - That was one of the few pieces of useful feedback from last year was to not break it up by professional and amateur categories. - I like the idea, but just like the Forum Hoards, you have to have active and enthused project managers to keep something like this going. I like it and I'll provide space for it in the Empire (Duchy of Modderburg) if it becomes a reality. Thanks.
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Post by flockofthese on Sept 9, 2013 11:52:23 GMT -9
I made that shoutbox post in good humor, because it was so difficult to decided on best of show. I probably should have used an emoticon. Still, a third vote isn't a bad idea for best of show. It could also use a third place. I don't know if the other categories need that third place prize though.
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Post by Parduz on Sept 9, 2013 12:20:20 GMT -9
About me, this awards was in the middle of my vacation. I reached them with my brain burned out, so while i kept lurking, i really started to look at the submissions in my last 2 vacation days. So, if i have to say something, i'd suggest to move it to the end of september (but i see how it can overlap a bit on the halloween hoard, so just take this for what it is ) For this same reason, i don't know almost nothing about the final prizes (i really have'nt read the posts). Another suggestion could be a single page to show all the submission (in thumbnails) and that links to all the voting polls. Just to make the whole voting process easier. I think it have been a great awards, plenty on entries that was both wonderfully realized and/or very original ideas. And this is my last suggestion: a prize for the most "innovative", original, previously unseen subject or idea. Thanks for your efforts, bot to Squirmydad and to the partecipant.
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Post by oldschooldm on Sept 9, 2013 13:06:54 GMT -9
Much better this year, I think, in terms of lower controversy (and greater diversity.)
Agree that we need to work on promotion before the event (to get more entrants) and then for the voting period.
3rd place for "Best of Show" would be great - and even for the other categories...
If we're considering categories (and increasing the number of entrants) might I suggest: Live Play display. This would lighten the restriction on "all paper" (allowing plastic/metal minis) and open allow for more casual entrants. Since many of the builders only build for live-play, they could enter without having to meet the narrative/tell-a-story requirement. If this category existed, I would have entered this year (my Temple of Gardmore Abbey, probably.) Those inbound links would do wonders for the hobby, I think...
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Post by Vermin King on Sept 9, 2013 13:54:20 GMT -9
For Eric's first go at this, it went rather well. Since I am learning digital design (slowly) in an exchange of emails with Mauther of the PaperMau Blog, I'll probably be able to come up with something for next year.
Cole Camp, Missouri had their 97th Annual Fair this last weekend. I was paying attention to the different categories on what qualifies. Floriculture can have pieces that were not previously entered in other Cole Camp Fairs. Art (photography, painting and miscellaneous) required items done since the last Fair. Antique Tractors and Antique Cars go back forever. I think a 'Done in the last 12 months' category would work.
I think that six months before the contest, you need to start promoting.
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Post by madarchitect on Sept 9, 2013 13:56:25 GMT -9
Here is my 2 (euro:P)cents. 1. Number of votes. Two votes for general categories is just right IMHO. The slight discomfort of not being able to vote for everything you like force voters to make some deeper evaluation of submitted designs. (At least it was so in my case). In best in the show category it may by useful to give a number of votes depending on the total number of works submitted. E.g Up to 5 works 1 vote; up to 10 - 2 votes; up to 20 - 3 votes and so on. I can imagine Papercut awards 2015 with 50 or so submissions, where 3 votes may be too few. This category is governed, I think, less by rational and more by emotional factors (after all what is better a great single model or an outstanding diorama?) more votes can better show how the love of the people flows . 2. Celebrity judgement IS a bad idea, unless you have a jury of qualified experts, who could always clearly explain their judgement. I think a constructive criticism of an experienced judge (after revealing vote results) can be valuable both for the participants and voters (viewers). The difficult part is that the jury could not be involved in any way in the competition (nor their relatives, friends, acquaintances, accountants or pet doctors etc.) Otherwise there will always be foul smell, even with no actual foul play involved. Another difficult thing is to balance "expert votes" with "popular" votes. I think most of this was covered after last year Papercuts but still I think its was worth to say it. So... democracy is the worst of systems but, does someone know any better? 3. I think 5 categories is just the right number. Less would limit the creative possibilities, more would thin out the competition. When Papercuts will reach let's say 30 competitors then there will be space for more categories. Saying that I really like Parduzs idea of "most innovative" award. 4. About advertising. 6 months suggested by VerminKing should work IMHO , but with some strong reminders from time to time (like some big banner on the middle of the screen here on board or something). The interest must be upheld until the votes are closed. It is easy to get excited 5 months in advance an miss the voting window in the end. 5. Prizes for the 3rd place. Yes please, please, please But seriously I think a better chance for any prize will attract more competitors than one small chance for huge prize. (Serious mode off) At least until You (squirmydad) promote Papercut Awards to world renown, international TV transmitted event. 6. Size of the prize (and related thoughts) I cannot complain .The prizes were very generous especially for the general price of the hobby. I guess I could agree with spaceranger42 that they could be reduced and still be sweet but... Higher prizes always rise the stake, fuel the competition, and rise prestige of the event so I think it's all up to you Squirmydad, your vision and planned role for Papercuts showcase (and of course available resources) As for publishing designers (including myself) I think the awards are a worthy prize themselves. I would like to see some kind of official award tags for first three places in all categories that publishers could place somewhere on the cover or in description of their products. I know there is a Papercuts logo and people use it colouring it gold or whatever to indicate the amount of their success but it is still something like "do it yourself" (or rather "mod it yourself") trophy. A set of recognizable award tags/icons the same from edition to edition would help both publishers and build up the exposure of the showcase, as not only gold winners would promote Papercut Awards in the far world. I'm not sure if I am clear with what I mean but... just some thoughts Apart of all this I think it would be useful to discuss something like "technical and formal requirements and limitations for submissions". To avoid unnecessary fuss related with e.g amount postprocessing, or F/X in submissions for future showcases. Also IMHO "done in last 12 months" should be a requirement for all original design categories, and not a category itself. Maybe not in this thread but I think it's all worth to clarify before the next Awards. Uff... that was long. My respect to anyone who will read all this Anyway great work on this years showcase Eric. All hail the Emperor . Krzysiek
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Post by mahotsukai on Sept 9, 2013 15:46:38 GMT -9
I think that I was the First to shout about numbers of votes. It was a comment on the quality of the entrants, rather than an actual need for more votes.
Just struck me, maybe a ranking system rather than votes could be a way to go.
What about badges or banners on winners avatars. A miniature site I am on uses these, it gives kudos to the winners and advertises the existence of the competition.
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Post by cowboyleland on Sept 9, 2013 16:17:33 GMT -9
I, like Parduz, was in and out of town during the voting period but I didn't actually manage to vote. Maybe if we have a longer promo period we could also have a longer voting period. And the thumbnails all on one page does strike me as a good idea. I also like the idea of a "most innovative" award.
If you can manage a third place prise, then a ranking system where voters have three votes could work nicely. Of course, this could lead to everyone's second choice winning. while someone with a lot of first place votes come in second or third. I think that would be OK (but I'm Canadian)
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Post by Brave Adventures on Sept 9, 2013 16:44:02 GMT -9
I support a 3rd place award as well.
I personally think once a month sounds nice, but wouldn't be practical. I don't think many people would be able to participate that frequently. I think twice a year could work though!
I agree. I think moving forward Papercut Awards entries should be limited to miniatures, models, dioramas etc. produced in the year of the competition. Or if it is a biannual thing, within 6 months of the competition.
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Post by flockofthese on Sept 9, 2013 16:57:28 GMT -9
If you would like to spread out the prizes a bit more, and potentially increase the number of entries, you could try a lottery of some sort. Like, for every category you enter you are given one 'ticket'. Then squirmydad,or whoever, can put names in a hat, one per each entry, then draw one randomly. That person will get some sort of prize. I'm not saying that I feel this really adds any substance to the competition, but it may help to get more people involved. It may have the potential to backfire though. It might make people throw some stuff together in 5 minutes just to get the lottery entries. I'm new here, having joined up right before this contest started. I don't know the community well enough to know how well this would work. I'm just throwing the idea out there.
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Post by wyvern on Sept 10, 2013 9:56:22 GMT -9
Another suggestion could be a single page to show all the submission (in thumbnails) and that links to all the voting polls. Just to make the whole voting process easier. I think it have been a great awards, plenty on entries that was both wonderfully realized and/or very original ideas. And this is my last suggestion: a prize for the most "innovative", original, previously unseen subject or idea. Thanks for your efforts, bot to Squirmydad and to the partecipant. I agree on all points. Keep the awards annual and fix the time well in advance, so everyone knows when they'll be coming up and can allow time to check in here to see what's been submitted and vote. With Hoards a few times through the year too, it might be useful to have all spaced fairly evenly, so we're not too much "feast & famine". Like the idea of some kind of badge/symbol for the winners, and to help publicise what the awards are about. Assuming that doesn't make the Forum so hugely popular we'll never be free of the ads again, anyway!
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Post by squirmydad on Sept 22, 2013 10:12:30 GMT -9
Lots of good feedback here, thank you to everyone who has participated so far. Changes for the future; -Earlier notice of the event, 6 months sounds good for a warning, then 3 months for the standby, then 6 weeks for the flood of reminders. -Third place in each category, easily done. -Badges...Proboards claims to have a badge ability, I'll have to investigate that further. Democracy and the will of the masses...I know some people were concerned that voting might be based on personal feelings instead of the quality of the entries, I don't believe that happened this year. I'm not really a fan of celebrity judges, even having been one, as I think they can 'skew' the results in a fashion that is more dictated by their personal tastes; for instance, I didn't vote for oldschooldm's diorama last year as I thought the Terraclips on the scenery created a great deal of visual clutter and detracted from the overall piece. That was just my opinion, but as a judge it became a very powerful opinion. I like transparency in voting. I think the public can vote on what they like pretty easily. Why they like it is somewhat irrelevant to their vote. The pieces that I have seen win over the years are the ones that are innovative, evocative, dynamic in pose and color, original in concept, and presented well. I'm looking forward to another year of Papercuts with even more entries. Thanks.
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Post by okumarts on Oct 3, 2013 15:46:21 GMT -9
I'm hoping to get my prizes out the door next week. Real life work has been intruding into my fun life.
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Post by squirmydad on Feb 26, 2015 12:21:53 GMT -9
Papercuts 2013 gallery has been uploaded. link
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