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Post by Vermin King on Oct 8, 2016 10:04:00 GMT -9
I'd meant to do one of these earlier, but as with most of my projects, I hit a roadblock or lose interest. With Medieval Mayhem taking place ( cardboard-warriors.proboards.com/thread/7913/medieval-mayhem-forum-hoard-october ), I thought this was a project that could be revived. There are various layouts for Coaching Inns. Some consist of a main building with a gateway to the innyard, stables and public house. Others seem to be a string of buildings with the gateway area seeming to be an alley that is 'filled in'. And I saw one that intrigued me. It seemed to be at a slight jog in the road, with two angled buildings and a connecting building that had the gateway to the innyard. First step was to get the wonky building geometry (building 1) The connecting building (building 2) adjoins at the narrower face of this building. The building on the other end (building 3)will be a mirror of building 1, but retextured. Sometime down the road, I'd like to do additional buildings and structures. The stables would be back in the innyard, and a public house should also be back there. There should also be a wing with additional rooms. I'd also like to do a set of exterior covered walkways and balconies for the wing and the backs of these buildings, but don't hold your breath. I've started texturing buildings one and two. Because it isn't that hard, I'll do a stand-alone version of building 2. I also intend to do a rectangular arch inset, in case you want the doors open for the arch. Building 1 can be a stand-alone already I worked up some off-white brick textures which are the placeholders until I can get back to texturing. I think this has promise, even if it is going to be a bit large
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Post by Vermin King on Oct 9, 2016 17:37:00 GMT -9
Okay, I screwed something up in doing the right side of Building 1. I think it looks good, but it has to be fixed. Odd, that I was using 'Paste Into' to avoid messing up geometry, but I still ended up with the peak flattened. Easier to fix than to figure out where I messed up
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Post by Vermin King on Oct 10, 2016 4:02:11 GMT -9
Fixed and started on the back wall of Building 1 Took the Outline of the Original Geometry and overlaid it on the template to figure out what needed fixed. I also think those arches looked to big relative to the windows, so shrank them and made the windows bigger
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Post by Vermin King on Oct 10, 2016 18:33:46 GMT -9
As I've been looking at Inn Yards and angles of Coaching Inns from the ends, neither is very elaborate, at least not as elaborate as the front. I think I've settled on the look of the back wall of Building 1, which is the end of the complex. While the inn yard side will be less austere than the end, I want it to be similar in appearance. My brick that I was using as placeholders and the base texture of the end and back walls looked too clean, so I dirtied it up a bit. I'm going to rework the back wall of building 2 to blend in with this look. I was looking at inns and inn yards again on a couple websites (Heart of England and Heritage Explorer) and noticed two instances where tourists took photos from the inn yards. You can see the front arch through the opening, but the back entrance to the arch was squared off, more utilitarian. If you look at old paintings of inn yards, they seem to fit into two categories: utilitarian or nice. The nice ones invariably have the covered walkways. So the inn yard of the White Hart is going to be utilitarian. Here's where I'm at currently I haven't updated building 2, but here's where it stands. I think you will agree that the back is not going to blend well with building 1. If you are building the complex, the ends will act as 'formers' in the building. I'll do a substitute page 2 for the appropriate roof for a free-standing building Am I on the right track here?
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Post by cowboyleland on Oct 10, 2016 19:04:46 GMT -9
I think you are on the right track. II would only say that the white looks a little too white at the moment. It should probably match the ground floor window frames more.
Gonna be cool.
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Post by Vermin King on Oct 11, 2016 4:20:42 GMT -9
I'm of two minds on that. In paintings and photos, the white (on the inns and rich merchant buildings, anyway) are very white. I think it was their way of showing that they are rich and this would be a great place to stay. On the other hand, they burned wood to heat their homes and buildings, and maybe even peat or coal. White can't stay white for very long. I think I need to tone the white down.
Thanks for the feedback. I'll probably do a toned-down version separately, and keep this one around, so we can compare the two
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Post by Vermin King on Oct 11, 2016 9:47:58 GMT -9
Over lunch I played with this a bit. Tried it with the ground floor window frames color, and everything looked too blue. So I took various samples of color from the brickwork on the back, and came up with something I'm not entirely satisfied with, but I'm on the right track, I think Only the difference in color isn't as great as it seems on the files. Maybe I can work on it again tonight
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Post by migibb on Oct 11, 2016 12:38:00 GMT -9
Funnily enough - and apropos of nothing at all to do with this thread - the pub directly under my flat is called the White Hart. And is one of two different bars claiming to be the oldest pub in Edinburgh..... Not a coaching inn though.....
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Post by Vermin King on Oct 11, 2016 12:39:35 GMT -9
And definitely not an Elizabethan original entrance
Are there more White Harts or Red Lions in Great Britain?
I'm not happy with the narrow doors on building 1 p1, either. I've got quite a bit of work to do to get this to where I'm happy with it.
On the other hand, it's almost use-able at this point. Learned to take my original geometry, take the outline and paste over the working parts to check that I haven't messed something up before saving. I'm also copying doors from other models to check size, which brings up my problem. And constantly working at 300ppi with the grid set at 75. Definitely being more careful these days. I'm half tempted to print one up, but then I'd have to do another one later.
I also came up with an idea on the archway. An open-sided box. The open side would have tabs for gluing to the backside square arch. The front archway would be seen from the back opening, and you can either have the gate closed or you can cut it and fold the doors back into the archway.
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Post by migibb on Oct 11, 2016 12:43:43 GMT -9
But if you zoom in enough to the window the second from the right above the pub, you can just about make out the Groo paper figures on the top of the bookshelf in my living room.........
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Post by Vermin King on Oct 11, 2016 12:55:36 GMT -9
I've actually got a photo of that one in my White Hart file, but the photo I had was from the wrong angle to spy on your living room
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Post by Vermin King on Oct 11, 2016 17:50:57 GMT -9
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Post by Vermin King on Oct 12, 2016 17:11:39 GMT -9
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Post by aleks on Oct 13, 2016 0:23:38 GMT -9
Papercut! Papercut! Papercut!
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Post by Vermin King on Oct 13, 2016 3:59:04 GMT -9
I wish I could find the Inn that sat on the curve again. I don't remember where I saw the image and I didn't save it. I'm thinking of making the Guild Hall square. In photos and paintings of Guild Halls, you don't see them squished into available space, like most of the other buildings. Guild Halls, Churches and Market Halls seem to take the attitude of 'all else be damned, but we are building this here!' I think it needs to be square. Otherwise this building will need another purpose.
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Post by Vermin King on Oct 13, 2016 16:48:16 GMT -9
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Post by Vermin King on Oct 14, 2016 16:00:47 GMT -9
Image 4 and Image 8 are going to be my main inspiration for Building 3, The Guildhall. The building will not be 'wonky'. Right angles. I think I have it worked out for doing a partial overhanging section with arches like in the eighth photo, and I am working out how far the building has to stick out from building 2 to allow that and stairs. I would like to have the stairs run parallel to the wall where that window is. But that makes the building stick out further than I really want. Under the overhang will be warehouse doors. I think I will do dormers on building 3, too. Just not as wide. I'm trying to keep the number of pages down.
Do I keep working on geometry for building 3, or do I build 1 & 2? It's late. I might just put it off for another day
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Post by Vermin King on Oct 15, 2016 3:10:29 GMT -9
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Post by cowboyleland on Oct 16, 2016 17:52:45 GMT -9
I haven't checked in for a few days. This is coming along. I like your new avatar BTW.
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Post by Vermin King on Oct 17, 2016 4:24:27 GMT -9
I haven't checked in for a few days. This is coming along. I like your new avatar BTW. Thank chiefasaur for the avatar.
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Post by Vermin King on Oct 17, 2016 18:01:09 GMT -9
Yeah, I need to learn sketchup or something. finally got the arches to work out as far as the inner part of the arch going from the base on one side, all the way around and down to the base at the other side, with the corner parts meeting squarely at the corner, only the arch is too short. I might have to forgo having it 3d. Razzum, frazzum
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Post by berneart76 on Oct 18, 2016 6:23:34 GMT -9
Yeah, I need to learn sketchup or something. finally got the arches to work out as far as the inner part of the arch going from the base on one side, all the way around and down to the base at the other side, with the corner parts meeting squarely at the corner, only the arch is too short. I might have to forgo having it 3d. Razzum, frazzum I can hep with the arch if you'd like
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Post by Vermin King on Oct 18, 2016 6:50:18 GMT -9
Wonderful. What I'm hoping for is something similar to the Totnes Guildhall in that the building hangs over an arched section. Instead of the columns, I'd like to have two archways meeting at a corner column. The covered portico should be 2 inches X 2 inches. The corner column 1/2 inch X 1/2 inch. I'd like the arch to be 1 1/2 inches tall. Sorry, I was on the phone when I typed the arch height, but it is corrected now. Thanks, berneart76
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Post by Vermin King on Oct 18, 2016 7:29:09 GMT -9
Before you volunteered, I was thinking of going with just a rectangular corner column and headers across the openings, instead of using arches.
But arches look so much better
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Post by berneart76 on Oct 18, 2016 8:42:55 GMT -9
Vermin King Is this sort of what you were thinking? The right hand side will go against the building, the left arch will extend out from the building. In this pic it has a flat roof. There is an inner arch from the outer (roadway arch) to the part that goes under the building. The measurements tend to drift a bit in Sketchup, I'll fix the goofy 1/64" and 1/32" offsets when I do the unfolding
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Post by Vermin King on Oct 18, 2016 9:07:09 GMT -9
This is what I'm trying to get the corner to look like
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Post by berneart76 on Oct 18, 2016 9:28:11 GMT -9
OK, I'll have it for you shortly, do you want a fully vaulted inner roof, or just a 1/2 inch header like in the picture below? from the message we exchanged, I got a misplaced impression that you wanted an extension going off the building over the roadway to the left of the Totnes hall..
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Post by Vermin King on Oct 18, 2016 10:05:40 GMT -9
As far as the ceiling area and interior walls, except for the corner column and the arches, I pictured it all open. The upper inside walls won't be seen, so the header and upper interior walls won't be necessary This geometry is going to be merged with the building
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Post by berneart76 on Oct 18, 2016 10:43:50 GMT -9
Will get the unfolded layout to you a bit later today, adding the tabs and will do a quick test Build of it as well, but leaves need to be mulched before it decides to rain again...
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Post by Vermin King on Oct 18, 2016 11:19:16 GMT -9
I hear you sir. Thank you.
I had the ratios worked out last night and it could be built, but with the archway at only 1 1/4 inches tall. When I started changing the layout to allow for a taller arch I messed something up. My guess is that at some point, I only enlarged the wall pieces and not the arch inserts. And I had thought I was being careful. I knew I was too tired last night to be working on something that required extra care, and that proved it.
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