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Post by jeffgeorge on Mar 29, 2017 6:34:23 GMT -9
When the conversation quiets down here in the Cardboard Warriors forum, and I'm feeling like saying something about something, I like to hop over to DriveThruRPG, pick a couple of products I've bought and liked, and type up a quick, single-paragraph review of them. I figure this helps out the creators in this community, who make all these great miniatures available to us at such reasonable prices, AND it may help a DTRPG shopper or two to make their first cardstock mini purchases, ultimately growing our niche in the hobby.
In fairness, I've bought dozens (hundreds?) of things from DTRPG, especially if you count the free ones, so I'll never get to all of them, but I do make it a point to post positive reviews of good products from our friends here at the forum when I have the time. I don't know if positive reviews make any difference to sales at all, but I figure they can't hurt.
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Post by nolabert on Mar 29, 2017 10:56:49 GMT -9
Yeah, this is something I'm bad at. But I'll take jeffgeorge 's post as a challenge and try to write some reviews on the OBS sites. I've promoted the creators/publishers and this forum in other venues (like in Youtube comments for Black Magic Craft and other RPG channels).
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Post by mesper on Mar 29, 2017 13:03:45 GMT -9
I don't know if positive reviews make any difference to sales at all, but I figure they can't hurt. Actually in case of something more informative/elaborate (meaning not just "like it" it could be useful and helpful for other users, so at the end also for the publishers Then there is one more thing (and that's kinda universal issue, and I'm writing this as an ebooks/comics/movies consumer and many forums user) - somehow people who for any reason don't like the product or some feature, no matter why, with legit reason or not - they make complains quite easily, tending to score or review almost immediately and without any objections, while users who appreciate/like the product often remain as "silent majority", so in many cases overall picture might be kinda biased. Anyway, if you like some product or some specific features - do not hesitate sharing your experience with others - even if it doesn't directly help, it possibly could offset some haters or trolls, or just adds some different point of view, at least in some cases:)
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Post by Vermin King on Mar 29, 2017 13:14:30 GMT -9
I forget which product it was, but one time when I was doing a review, one jerk had given it a '2' for a rating when all others were a '5' except for a '4'.
It would be nice if there were a way in the system to weed out 'statistical anomalies' like that, but there isn't, so we just need to do our part in reviewing products and giving them a fair review, one that is somewhat informative
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Post by jeffgeorge on Mar 29, 2017 14:00:00 GMT -9
I forget which product it was, but one time when I was doing a review, one jerk had given it a '2' for a rating when all others were a '5' except for a '4'. It would be nice if there were a way in the system to weed out 'statistical anomalies' like that, but there isn't, so we just need to do our part in reviewing products and giving them a fair review, one that is somewhat informative The problem is that the samples are generally so small that you can't identify the anomalies as such. The only products I've seen that had a number of ratings that even approached statistical significance are all already so famous and successful that one more review, positive or negative, isn't going to make much difference. For example, Dungeon World has 130 ratings, which is WAY more than 99% of the products on OBS, and is barely large enough a sample to be regarded as statistically meaningful. I do think that most people understand that negative online reviews need to be taken with a grain of salt. Unless a negative review offers a very specific and compelling justification for its assessment, I regard it as what it is--one person's anecdotal perspective--and I figure that another person's (specifically, mine) is just as valid and, as you say, counterbalances an unfair or vague negative review.
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Post by jeffgeorge on Mar 29, 2017 14:10:50 GMT -9
Actually in case of something more informative/elaborate (meaning not just "like it" it could be useful and helpful for other users, so at the end also for the publishers Then there is one more thing (and that's kinda universal issue, and I'm writing this as an ebooks/comics/movies consumer and many forums user) - somehow people who for any reason don't like the product or some feature, no matter why, with legit reason or not - they make complains quite easily, tending to score or review almost immediately and without any objections, while users who appreciate/like the product often remain as "silent majority", so in many cases overall picture might be kinda biased. Anyway, if you like some product or some specific features - do not hesitate sharing your experience with others - even if it doesn't directly help, it possibly could offset some haters or trolls, or just adds some different point of view, at least in some cases:) That's exactly why I always make a point to invest 3 or 4 sentences in explaining why I liked the product, and why I'm recommending it. A 5 rating doesn't mean much, but a paragraph telling what's good about a product carries a little more weight...I think. It certainly does for me, when I'm reading reviews myself. And, as I mentioned to Vermin King , I pretty much disregard negative reviews and ratings that don't bother to justify the number they assigned the product. I'm more likely to be warned off a product with a 3 rating by a review that gives a pretty compelling reason for criticizing the product than I am by a 1 rating with no more explanation than "Utter cr@p. Don't bother." For example, if I was considering buying a set of printable minis that had nice looking promo photos, but had a 3 rating from a reviewer who said something like, "Nice art, but the backs are silhouettes, so I can't give it a 5," I'd take that very seriously, not buy the product, and be grateful to the reviewer for saving me $3 to spend on something I'd like better. If I really did think the figures were buying if they had backs, I might make a suggestion to that effect in the discussion, in hopes that my comment might help the artist improve the appeal or usefulness of his product, and ultimately increase his sales. I don't think I'm all that special in this (except maybe the suggestion part--I've got a big mouth). I do think that most online shoppers are pretty savvy about assessing the significance of various types of online reviews.
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Post by jeffgeorge on Mar 29, 2017 14:17:03 GMT -9
Yeah, this is something I'm bad at. But I'll take jeffgeorge 's post as a challenge and try to write some reviews on the OBS sites. I've promoted the creators/publishers and this forum in other venues (like in Youtube comments for Black Magic Craft and other RPG channels). I figure if I do two four-sentence reviews a week, I'm meeting my quota. Sometimes I do as many as 4 in a sitting, but that's rare. But I do think that putting the reviews ON the page where they shopper can click the buy button has a different, and more specific, effect than promoting a product, line, or category in other media. I guess a real business person would regard the reviews on the product page on OBS as a sales message (you should/should not buy this thing today), while mentions elsewhere on the web would be marketing messages (have you heard about Skinny Mini's printable figures? You should go to DTRPG and check them out some time). Both are important, but they are also different from one another. For whatever that's worth.
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Post by okumarts on Mar 29, 2017 15:58:18 GMT -9
Aww, that's awesome Jeff! Thank you! I always forget to check reviews.
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Post by okumarts on Mar 29, 2017 15:58:53 GMT -9
Actually in case of something more informative/elaborate (meaning not just "like it" it could be useful and helpful for other users, so at the end also for the publishers Then there is one more thing (and that's kinda universal issue, and I'm writing this as an ebooks/comics/movies consumer and many forums user) - somehow people who for any reason don't like the product or some feature, no matter why, with legit reason or not - they make complains quite easily, tending to score or review almost immediately and without any objections, while users who appreciate/like the product often remain as "silent majority", so in many cases overall picture might be kinda biased. Anyway, if you like some product or some specific features - do not hesitate sharing your experience with others - even if it doesn't directly help, it possibly could offset some haters or trolls, or just adds some different point of view, at least in some cases:) That's exactly why I always make a point to invest 3 or 4 sentences in explaining why I liked the product, and why I'm recommending it. A 5 rating doesn't mean much, but a paragraph telling what's good about a product carries a little more weight...I think. It certainly does for me, when I'm reading reviews myself. And, as I mentioned to Vermin King , I pretty much disregard negative reviews and ratings that don't bother to justify the number they assigned the product. I'm more likely to be warned off a product with a 3 rating by a review that gives a pretty compelling reason for criticizing the product than I am by a 1 rating with no more explanation than "Utter cr@p. Don't bother." For example, if I was considering buying a set of printable minis that had nice looking promo photos, but had a 3 rating from a reviewer who said something like, "Nice art, but the backs are silhouettes, so I can't give it a 5," I'd take that very seriously, not buy the product, and be grateful to the reviewer for saving me $3 to spend on something I'd like better. If I really did think the figures were buying if they had backs, I might make a suggestion to that effect in the discussion, in hopes that my comment might help the artist improve the appeal or usefulness of his product, and ultimately increase his sales. I don't think I'm all that special in this (except maybe the suggestion part--I've got a big mouth). I do think that most online shoppers are pretty savvy about assessing the significance of various types of online reviews. The specifics are REALLY appreciated!
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Post by jeffgeorge on Mar 29, 2017 18:56:57 GMT -9
Aww, that's awesome Jeff! Thank you! I always forget to check reviews. The one thing I forgot to mention in my review of Kingdom of Richard was that the model for the portrait of King Richard on page 9 was clearly Willie Nelson. You didn't think you were gonna slip that one past a former Austinite, did you?
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Post by whisper31 on Mar 30, 2017 4:38:10 GMT -9
I guess I should toss in my two pence worth here. First off, let me say that I am really guilty of not following up on my reviews and personal takes on things that I order and purchase, and I would like to apologize profusely to those designers, authors, and artists that do such a wonderful job of things that I am unable to do myself. I will try to start putting reviews on the products I have gotten. But since I won't use many of them for a while yet (still have to cut about a hundred Dungeon Plungin' figs), or a few games that I want to get to put together at the moment. I did put a review up for Star Confrontations, and for the price they were offering when I picked it up I didn't expect a whole lot. You can read my review on the DTRPG website for Star Confrontations here. I have talked with a few of you directly about your products and asked some questions regarding doing something with them that wasn't in the original product I got. okumarts and Christopher Roe especially. But the thing that I have found troubling for me, is that I usually find something years after it has been out and there really doesn't seem to be any more support or discussion about the products. Armor Grid Games and OverSoul Games seem to have died out before I purchased/downloaded the systems and minis (we won't discuss WWG). So usually there is no place for me to even put a review of their products. Working the hours and days that I do, I usually don't have time to get with a group of players to play them very much. I usually try to find things that I can play solo and once I can get a few games under my belt, I can give an honest review of the game/figure/terrain/etc. Hope this makes sense as I seem to ramble on quite a bit at times.
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Post by alloydog on Mar 30, 2017 5:50:35 GMT -9
Could someone run a PBeM role playing game? I couldn't run one - life is too busy at the mo' but I could take patt in one. Just saying...
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Post by jeffgeorge on Mar 30, 2017 9:52:45 GMT -9
I guess I should toss in my two pence worth here. First off, let me say that I am really guilty of not following up on my reviews and personal takes on things that I order and purchase, and I would like to apologize profusely to those designers, authors, and artists that do such a wonderful job of things that I am unable to do myself. I will try to start putting reviews on the products I have gotten. But since I won't use many of them for a while yet (still have to cut about a hundred Dungeon Plungin' figs), or a few games that I want to get to put together at the moment. I did put a review up for Star Confrontations, and for the price they were offering when I picked it up I didn't expect a whole lot. You can read my review on the DTRPG website for Star Confrontations here. I have talked with a few of you directly about your products and asked some questions regarding doing something with them that wasn't in the original product I got. okumarts and Christopher Roe especially. But the thing that I have found troubling for me, is that I usually find something years after it has been out and there really doesn't seem to be any more support or discussion about the products. Armor Grid Games and OverSoul Games seem to have died out before I purchased/downloaded the systems and minis (we won't discuss WWG). So usually there is no place for me to even put a review of their products. Working the hours and days that I do, I usually don't have time to get with a group of players to play them very much. I usually try to find things that I can play solo and once I can get a few games under my belt, I can give an honest review of the game/figure/terrain/etc. Hope this makes sense as I seem to ramble on quite a bit at times. I get what you're saying about the difficulties encountered when you discover a game for the first time years after its publisher has faded away--not having anyplace to post a review is often the least of your worries (but we said we wouldn't talk about WWG...). Since I have way more products that I could review than I will ever have time to get to, I prioritize products from publishers who are members of this community that have few or no reviews already. I generally only write reviews of products that I feel are genuine five-star successes; if I can't give something an honest five stars, I just don't review it. I only make exceptions to my five-stars-only policy in two cases. First, if a product is really good, but has one flaw or oddity that might matter to some people but not bother others, I'll write a positive, 4-star review that points out that oddity. And second, if something (a) costs money, (b) is really objectively bad (as opposed to just not to my personal taste), and (c) the publisher is not a member of this forum, I'll write an honest negative review, to stop other people from throwing away money the same way I did. I don't think that's happened to me on DriveThru yet, and I hope it never does. My point with the original post is that typing in a three-sentence review only takes five minutes, and might really help out the creators in our community.
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Post by jeffgeorge on Mar 30, 2017 9:56:09 GMT -9
Could someone run a PBeM role playing game? I couldn't run one - life is too busy at the mo' but I could take patt in one. Just saying... Not necessarily a bad idea, but maybe a bit off-topic. When I named the thread, I was trying to sucker people in and trick them into writing reviews to help our friends. If you want to get some PBeM action going, you might want to start a thread with a more descriptive title...
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