|
Post by aaron on Jul 20, 2014 17:07:51 GMT -9
that truck looks amazing but the question I have is this, is anyone really interested in building more complex 28mm models for a table top war game. the reason I ask this is because I have posted many different types of models including 40k replicas but I get little or no response from anyone. so I think well maybe they were to complicated and I should just make them flat? is there any merit to that line of thinking? let me give you an example. here we have the model for an Space-elf fate-seer on a anitgravity bike the parts aren't numbered but it's really simple I have seen children figure it out pretty quickly so I figured most people could put it together fairly easily ... I have one for the warlock and guardians as well on my deviant art page. I thought I would get a huge response on this as an all antigravity bike army costs somewhere in the vacinity of $777.USD Im not kidding either that's how much it costs check it out! www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Saim-Hann-Skimmers so because I made the floating pit snakes and the bird of prey, combustible triangle and fuchsia seeker of prey I thought anyone who wanted to make a skimmy army would be able to do it for 1 10000th of the price and it will still look pretty sweet interestingly enough I got little or no response at all and even-though I have had thousands of views their are almost no comments, very few if any downloads... I think either I made them to complex or not complex enough ?? it's a balancing game to be sure but I'm still trying to figure out the in between. of coarse their is the third option that I just suck LOL what's your take one it Vermin King ?
|
|
|
Post by wildagreenbough on Jul 20, 2014 17:38:16 GMT -9
aaron, I can only go from my experience here in New Zealand as here 40K is generally played by self absorbed pre-teens whose thinking is definitely concrete operational and getting them to accept cool paper models as a serious alternative would break their tiny little brains.
As to vehicle models I've been looking around for lightweight tank models for a Police vs Scary Aliens and their Scary Robots type scenario and the big difficulty I'm having is that any suitable paper tank model is just that, - a model. I don't really want to spend hours cutting out and putting together 3000 tiny pieces just so I can have a tank in my game. So far I've pretty much standardised on Papermau's Easy-To-Build vehicles for Police and Ambulance vehicles, but I'm having no luck with finding an easy to build tank.
papermau.blogspot.co.nz/search?q=easy+to+build
So I guess it's a balancing act between offering a visually nice looking vehicle, but it also has to be quick and easy to cut out and assemble; - especially if several are required to play the game.
Edit: I just went and had a look at that $777 skimmer army and just about spluttered green tea all over my monitor. That is just plain insane.
|
|
|
Post by Vermin King on Jul 20, 2014 18:02:11 GMT -9
Honestly, I need to have a reason to build any model with more than 16 parts. I don't do 40k, so I had no reason to build it
|
|
|
Post by wildagreenbough on Jul 20, 2014 18:23:20 GMT -9
I went and had a look at Aaron's Deviant Art page and I've downloaded his three Eldar Jetbikes. In my brief time playing 40K I was an Eldar and Imperial Guard Tallarn player. I cannot stand GW's Space Marines and I have several that I'm going to do clever and diabolical conversions on just to demonstrate now much I dislike them.
While I was over at Deviant Art I also had a good look at Aaron's TO artwork which I really like so I guess this means that I'm going to end up being a Kickstarter supporter.
|
|
|
Post by aaron on Jul 20, 2014 18:49:15 GMT -9
LOL I think you illustrated my point better than I ever could Vermin King. I personally don't like 40k anymore it's a game of madness for insane people. but that's a rant for another time. you need a good reason to build a model with more than 16 parts.... and I need a good reason to make a model with more than 16 parts LOL I think you represent most of the paper game playing world. so I need to go back to my game and stream line the models so they don't have more than 4 or 5 pieces since like 4ok Temporum Oblitus has lots of models in multiple units like the Grack riders come in squads of 5 and the rocket bikes (again a model that I posted on the forums but it met with lack luster audience becaue it was kind of complex also comes in a squad of 5. My orifinal thinking was flawed you see and I am coming to understand that now. you see 40k playes like big modles with lots of parts but they have to be plastic or metel and htey need to come from GW because their is a certin status that goes along with the models. they don't really care about the game, how could they the rules read like russian stero instructions beeing read by an Italin scooba diver... who doens't speak Russian. 40k is a rich nerd status symbol. Paper-craft gamers don't care (as much ) about the models as they do about the game. If the game doesn't look as good but completely kicks @$$ then they will over look or sub models from other systems. if the models look great but the game sucks then you get the models and use them to play the game that kicks @$$ but doesn't look so good. So really I need to cut back on the models and really polish the game. new rocket bikes will be 3 maybe 4 pieces. ok sooo I think we have just had a really really good marketing moment and I want to thank you for participating Vermin King LOL I think you have helped me more than you know! for that I will send you free stuff!
|
|
|
Post by cowboyleland on Jul 20, 2014 19:41:15 GMT -9
aaron, I know this is rough, but I hope it conveys the idea. It is a very simple way to make a model with some 3dishness. I hope it inspires you. I really think vehicles wider than a horse need to have a bigger footprint than 2d.
|
|
|
Post by sirhelnor on Jul 21, 2014 4:07:25 GMT -9
These were by you? I found them ages ago and printed some off, i just never got around to sitting down and making them... small world. I guess I'll have to find where they're hiding in my apartment and give it a go (and give you my two cents of course lol)
|
|
|
Post by aaron on Jul 21, 2014 4:23:57 GMT -9
Thanks cowboyleland that's more or less the direction I was starting to take with everything I think the foe hammer will be a bit more than that but no more than 6 pieces yep sirhelnor that was me! wait why do you sound so surprised ? I did an entire "space elf" army at one point but no one seemed to care about it so I took most of it down. and then I made Temporum Oblitus and that's actually a game instead of a place for you to show off your toys and roll some dice. LOL
|
|
|
Post by wildagreenbough on Jul 21, 2014 4:59:23 GMT -9
You did an entire Space Elf army! - Why was I not told?
What foolish folk to shun perfectly good Space Elves. Now I really do have positive confirmation that the greater bulk of 40K players are indeed expensive plastic addicts and care nothing for art.
|
|
|
Post by Vermin King on Jul 21, 2014 7:00:05 GMT -9
As I was looking at the 'buggy', my first thought was to have the fenders like Norbtach does on his semi's. www.norbtach.nl/bouwplaat/truckshop/truckshop.htmlFlat plate for bottom of the chassis. Two pieces for the fender/wheel assembly. Then a box for the body, with another box inserted for the driver's cabin. 2d or 2.5d for the gunner position. I think the overall feel of the vehicle could be captured in less than ten pieces. Probably about eight
|
|
|
Post by aaron on Jul 21, 2014 8:40:15 GMT -9
believe it or not I'm going to do it a lot like cowboyleland I am trying to get it down to just two pieces. simple and easy. it will loose a lot of it's cool factor but it's a price I am willing to pay to get more people interested in playing. I am currently putting together an Alpha team for testing and design do you want to be on it? in fact if anyone is interested let me know and we can discuss the criteria for being a member of the team!
|
|
|
Post by cowboyleland on Jul 21, 2014 18:04:23 GMT -9
I had a workable idea. That IS unbelievable Just joshin' ya Aaron. I'm going to offer you a few more ideas. Watch for a pm.
|
|
|
Post by Vermin King on Jul 21, 2014 18:13:27 GMT -9
believe it or not I'm going to do it a lot like cowboyleland I am trying to get it down to just two pieces. simple and easy. it will loose a lot of it's cool factor but it's a price I am willing to pay to get more people interested in playing. I am currently putting together an Alpha team for testing and design do you want to be on it? in fact if anyone is interested let me know and we can discuss the criteria for being a member of the team! Less pieces does not necessarily mean an easier build. I honestly think that about five would maintain ease of build and capture the lines well. That five would include the gunner position is that testing and design of the model or the game?
|
|
|
Post by aaron on Jul 21, 2014 18:54:04 GMT -9
My alpha team is going to help play test the game and alpha /beta test that models to make sure they work. on the down side you would have to print my crappy models until I get them right and play the game a lot giving me feed back so I can refined it into complete product , on the up side it doesn't usually take to long to get them right and you would get the beta version of the game free (obviously) and all the models that it comes with, on the down side you would be joining my ultra secret Alpha society and you couldn't tell anyone about what we were doing and how we were secretly planning on taking over the world!! .... wait did I just say that out loud .... oh well.... anyway well with enough kicking and swearing I got my wife's old printer to spit out just a few more copies this is the scorpion that I have now
|
|
|
Post by cadia134 on Jul 22, 2014 14:35:32 GMT -9
I think you may have gone too far the other direction. I would prefer actual wheels, and the bottom and back to be solid. Using 2d for the gunner is great.
|
|
|
Post by aaron on Jul 22, 2014 14:43:35 GMT -9
this is kind of a tough nut to crack, I can't go to far one way or the other ..... hummmm let me try one more time to see if I can't make some thing cool but not to complex!
|
|
|
Post by cadia134 on Jul 22, 2014 14:50:41 GMT -9
I think the nose as an elongated 4 sided pyramid, the cockpit as a U shape, folded over with design on the inside, the back as a cube, 3d wheels and maybe a spacer to keep the wheels away from the body. The nose would loose some of the curves, but the model would be so much more stable. The curvy bits on the bottom of the body could hang over the aforementioned U and cube. IS what I am saying making sense?
|
|
|
Post by aaron on Jul 22, 2014 15:11:33 GMT -9
kind of ... hummmm let me get jiggy with it and see what I can shake loose! that was my attempt at sounding cool... did it work? I've been hanging out with my kids to much LOL
|
|
|
Post by cowboyleland on Jul 24, 2014 5:05:33 GMT -9
|
|
|
Post by aaron on Jul 24, 2014 5:22:53 GMT -9
while those are defiantly cool I think I'm going to make this scorpion just a little more complicated that that now. after all this game is targets at people who like to put together really complex models soooooo I think I dummyied down the scorpion just a bit to much I think I will use the same basic design as before but the front will be wider and the tires will be separate on their own axle and the fenders are pretty awesome and deserve to stick off like the spikes that they are and it needs a back with the Core of Humanity symbol on it that way after their done hosing the enemy troops and their dying soldiers can look up from the dirt and the last thing they see will be the "in your face!" symbol of the core... plus it helps t-shirt sales .... but that's another story...
|
|
|
Post by aaron on Jul 24, 2014 11:12:51 GMT -9
ok for the last two days SOLID I have been working on the FOE HAMMER! the Core of Humanity heavy vehicle. it's not as much of a tank as it is a battle platform. it has three strafing weapons and a large template ordinance cannon that's capable of tearing down fortresses and that's saying something. sadly though everything has weaknesses and this guy is super slow, but then when you don't need line of site who needs to be fast? the crew are exposed to small arms fire (though getting close enough to shoot at them is a big risk) snipers are the enemy of this tank ... this is the Alpha build of this monster and though it has some kinks to work out ... most of them have been like the tower is to high and the bracing support in the back is going to be octagon at the end so you can mount the gunners in what ever direction you want them to be facing. the cannoneer is way to small ... I dot know how that happened ?? the back plate didn't have a HUGE Core of Humanity Symbol on the back ... the power core on the big cannon was a little wonky and the main body was a little to artsy... I fixed all of that but if any one sees anything that's a glaring eyesore let me know! oh and a huge shout out to my neighbor for printing this off for me LOL !!
|
|
|
Post by aaron on Jul 25, 2014 18:54:37 GMT -9
ok spent the day trying to figure out the Core of Humanity refueling depot.... finishing up the shock troopers squad !! with a squad size of 12 and an Attack of 20 a Range of 30 Defense 25 coming in at 20 requisition points per squad they make the perfect front line soldiers! and if they are un-engaged at the end of the Core players turn then they can move again! this makes them perfect for hemming in the enemy and taking key points on the table! their weak in close combat though so you want to keep the blade wielders at bay but if you combine them with the scorpion buggie and the Foe hammer tank they have the ability really lay down some savage firepower. now some of you are going to say wait yours goes to 11. yes their are only 11 troopers here but I am tired and going to bed but rest assured that the 12th trooper will be here by this time tomorrow!! that's a Core of Humanity Mini story right their !! the 12th Trooper!! that's so going in the army book!
|
|
|
Post by aaron on Jul 26, 2014 14:15:02 GMT -9
as promised the 12th warrior!
|
|
|
Post by aaron on Jul 28, 2014 17:13:50 GMT -9
one step away from full production model ! here we have another Pigmi Games Cardboard Warrior Exclusive!!! the Beta Scorpion attack buggie from the Core of Humanity!! In Temporum Oblitus All ground vehicles get to move 14 inches, but the scorpion gets to move 18 because it's lightweight and super fast, coming in a squad of three the gunner on the back is using a strafing weapon so for those of you who have been paying attention to the rules that means that if they all target the same thing they can do a structure point of damage! that means they can take out small cover and shred enemy troops and light vehicles. though on the down side they lack any kind of armor and the crew are exposed to small arms fire, this means that if you crash them into anything though they will deliver a full structure point of damage each to what ever they hit... they will be destroyed. the best way to use these guys is with back up from other troops or even another squad of scorpions! don't over extend your scorpions and they will do quite nicely!
|
|
|
Post by wildagreenbough on Jul 28, 2014 17:23:09 GMT -9
A very nice re-working of your Scorpion Aaron. I know it's been a lot of work, but you've got there in the end.
|
|
|
Post by cowboyleland on Jul 28, 2014 17:41:24 GMT -9
Looks cool aaron. One little thing, I don't think those little protrusions at the end of the gun barrel are big enough to cut out well. Maybe you should just leave them off.
|
|
|
Post by aaron on Jul 28, 2014 20:35:30 GMT -9
though I can see your point I put them there for a super nerdy reason so I will be leaving them, but you can always cut them off if you don't like them that's the cool part about paper it's chock full of customization!
|
|
|
Post by arcticdragongames on Jul 28, 2014 21:45:52 GMT -9
Neat, this even has the undercarriage.
|
|
|
Post by Vermin King on Jul 29, 2014 4:06:26 GMT -9
though I can see your point I put them there for a super nerdy reason so I will be leaving them, but you can always cut them off if you don't like them that's the cool part about paper it's chock full of customization! Thank you for this. And the tacit permission to customize. I'm working on that train project for the nursing home right now, and the three models that I have printed and scored need to be off my workspace, but this is going to be up next before I do more trains. Wish me luck with what I intend to do (nothing too drastic). I really like the way you chose to do the driver. It really makes sense.
|
|
|
Post by aaron on Jul 29, 2014 4:54:02 GMT -9
Thanks Vermin King!I would love to see what you do you have to take pictures LOL I actually have a full driver in a little box that went into a full cab .... it was one of those, looks good on paper but when you print it out it was impossible, kind of things ... and I designed it!!... so in the end i just used cowboyleland's suggestion to make it slotted.
|
|